55 replies to this topic

[HeavensChampion]

If Ken Penders died of old age or if his Lara-Su Chronicles project failed, would Archie and Sega reacquire his characters and concepts, or would they be doomed to fade away from memory?

[vgiannell5]

If Ken Penders died of old age or if his Lara-Su Chronicles project failed, would Archie and Sega reacquire his characters and concepts, or would they be doomed to fade away from memory?

I don't know about Penders dying of old age but I hope his Lara-Su Chronicles project does fail.

[furrykef]

There is no reason the rights would revert to Archie or Sega. His intellectual property would become the property of his estate, the same as for any other creative work.

[LogiTeeka]

^ Pretty much this.

It is possible for a company to enter legal negotiations with, or even purchase the rights from the estate. But considering all that's happened and the overall negative reception towards Penders' work, I doubt it's even worth the effort.

[Lynchenberg]

It's interesting that for all the people who hate Penders and think everything he's ever done is crap, the majority of fans do want to see his characters returned to the Sonic comic books.

[LogiTeeka]

It's interesting that for all the people who hate Penders and think everything he's ever done is crap, the majority of fans do want to see his characters returned to the Sonic comic books.

That is true. I guess Ian's writing redeemed much of the characters for lots of readers.

Though it is worth pointing out that Penders' creations weren't the only ones pulled from the comic. Karl Bollers, Mike Gallegher, Scott Fulop, Frank Storm, and Dan Slott were other notable writers that also had their material removed; since they too signed similar contracts. Even some of Flynn's own concepts can't be used anymore.

The only exception might be Angelo DeCesare, since he isn't a freelance writer and still works at Archie. But there hasn't been any word about the status of his creations yet.

[DCC]

Even though I had my problems with Ken's work(as I have with all the Archie writers) and some things that he has said or done, there were some characters(Jules, Bernie) or ideas(the "Upgrade" story) that I liked. I am sure that is the same way with some other fans.

[MoKat]

Even though I had my problems with Ken's work(as I have with all the Archie writers) and some things that he has said or done, there were some characters(Jules, Bernie) or ideas(the "Upgrade" story) that I liked. I am sure that is the same way with some other fans.

*nods*

Same here.  I actually enjoyed some of the things he did with Knuckles.  There were some interesting ideas that he could have executed better tho'.

[Uncle Ben]

 

It's interesting that for all the people who hate Penders and think everything he's ever done is crap, the majority of fans do want to see his characters returned to the Sonic comic books.

That is true. I guess Ian's writing redeemed much of the characters for lots of readers.

 

 

I think it's more or less of the amount of characters he made and most of the Echidnas really didnt bring anything special to the table. I mean characters like Geoffry, Elias, etc a lot of people would love to see back but the only echidnas people wanna see back is Julie-Su & Lien-Da.

[MoKat]

 

but the only echidnas people wanna see back is Julie-Su & Lien-Da.

And then there are people (like me) who wonder how he got away with Lien-Da's character design in the first place

[HeavensChampion]

There is no reason the rights would revert to Archie or Sega. His intellectual property would become the property of his estate, the same as for any other creative work.

Great. Now my darker side is going for blackmail. AGAIN! The only thing anybody would get from blackmail is a one-way ticket to the JAILHOUSE!

[HeavensChampion]

^ Pretty much this.

It is possible for a company to enter legal negotiations with, or even purchase the rights from the estate. But considering all that's happened and the overall negative reception towards Penders' work, I doubt it's even worth the effort.

I just want things back the way they were.

[Uncle Ben]

 

^ Pretty much this.

It is possible for a company to enter legal negotiations with, or even purchase the rights from the estate. But considering all that's happened and the overall negative reception towards Penders' work, I doubt it's even worth the effort.

I just want things back the way they were.

 

 

Some people do, some dont

[HeavensChampion]

There is no reason the rights would revert to Archie or Sega. His intellectual property would become the property of his estate, the same as for any other creative work.

But he created them for the comics.

[furrykef]

Yeah, but unless they signed a contract specifically stating that Penders' works revert to Archie or Sega or whoever after his death, they won't be treated differently than any other works.

[Vampfox]

 

It's interesting that for all the people who hate Penders and think everything he's ever done is crap, the majority of fans do want to see his characters returned to the Sonic comic books.

That is true. I guess Ian's writing redeemed much of the characters for lots of readers.
 

This. I liked Penders characters but only when Penders wasn't writing them.  Personally I'm more sad that we lost Karl Bollers(Dr Finitevus, Hope)and Mike Gallegher(Fiona Fox)characters then I am Penders.

[HeavensChampion]

Yeah, but unless they signed a contract specifically stating that Penders' works revert to Archie or Sega or whoever after his death, they won't be treated differently than any other works.

So you're saying the only way to get them back is to sign a contract that Ken Penders gives them?

[Lynchenberg]

 

That is true. I guess Ian's writing redeemed much of the characters for lots of readers.

 

 

That's one way of looking at it, and I'm sure it's true for some fans. However, I think it's also likely that many people genuinely enjoyed at least some of Penders' contributions. If you're in your 20s now and have been reading the comics since you were a teen or, like me, even earlier, you've been a fan of the world Penders and Bollers built. I was a massive fan of the Knuckles series from age seven to it's cancellation, and started reading Sonic with issue 52, up to just before the book really became a train wreck. It just started getting too dramatic to me, playing more like an episode of Dawson's Creek than an adventure story. I was also getting into other comics by fellas like Chester Brown, Alan Moore, and Frank Miller. I actually love drama, but the way it was beginning to be handled was cheesy, and it just got worse after I was gone. Whenever I look at the issues I missed however, most of the really god-awful stuff (the slap, Tails weeping with fused-together fingers) was written by Karl Bollers, not Penders. Which leads me to the conclusion that despite it's faults, fans generally liked what Penders brought to the table. I believe the backlash is mainly due to his shifty business practices, poor treatment of fans and professionals, the lawsuit, and perceived arrogance. Ian Flynn was on clean-up duty after Penders and Bollers left the book, but most of the characters he redeemed were messed up by Bollers, not Penders. Penders even revealed that if he hadn't been fired, a lot of what he was planning to do was cleaning up after Bollers as well, re-deeming Sally and the like. So I do think the long-time fans do (or at least once did) enjoy Penders' contributions more than they admit. I think the fans who want things to stay as they are now are generally those that got into the comics after Flynn established their current tone. And Flynn's reboot is a really good comic from what I've read. In fact, it's a lot better than I expected it to be. Is it exactly what I'd want out of a Sonic book? No, I'm someone who grew up on the Bollers-era, and despite my criticisms of his work, I really like a lot of what he did. I just think he took it too far. But Flynn's doing a good book, and I get why people who were introduced to this version of the series don't want to see it change.

[HeavensChampion]

 

 

That is true. I guess Ian's writing redeemed much of the characters for lots of readers.

 

 

That's one way of looking at it, and I'm sure it's true for some fans. However, I think it's also likely that many people genuinely enjoyed at least some of Penders' contributions. If you're in your 20s now and have been reading the comics since you were a teen or, like me, even earlier, you've been a fan of the world Penders and Bollers built. I was a massive fan of the Knuckles series from age seven to it's cancellation, and started reading Sonic with issue 52, up to just before the book really became a train wreck. It just started getting too dramatic to me, playing more like an episode of Dawson's Creek than an adventure story. I was also getting into other comics by fellas like Chester Brown, Alan Moore, and Frank Miller. I actually love drama, but the way it was beginning to be handled was cheesy, and it just got worse after I was gone. Whenever I look at the issues I missed however, most of the really god-awful stuff (the slap, Tails weeping with fused-together fingers) was written by Karl Bollers, not Penders. Which leads me to the conclusion that despite it's faults, fans generally liked what Penders brought to the table. I believe the backlash is mainly due to his shifty business practices, poor treatment of fans and professionals, the lawsuit, and perceived arrogance. Ian Flynn was on clean-up duty after Penders and Bollers left the book, but most of the characters he redeemed were messed up by Bollers, not Penders. Penders even revealed that if he hadn't been fired, a lot of what he was planning to do was cleaning up after Bollers as well, re-deeming Sally and the like. So I do think the long-time fans do (or at least once did) enjoy Penders' contributions more than they admit. I think the fans who want things to stay as they are now are generally those that got into the comics after Flynn established their current tone. And Flynn's reboot is a really good comic from what I've read. In fact, it's a lot better than I expected it to be. Is it exactly what I'd want out of a Sonic book? No, I'm someone who grew up on the Bollers-era, and despite my criticisms of his work, I really like a lot of what he did. I just think he took it too far. But Flynn's doing a good book, and I get why people who were introduced to this version of the series don't want to see it change.

 

You prefer Sonic's homeworld to be nameless?

[LogiTeeka]

That is true. I guess Ian's writing redeemed much of the characters for lots of readers.

That's one way of looking at it, and I'm sure it's true for some fans. However, I think it's also likely that many people genuinely enjoyed at least some of Penders' contributions. If you're in your 20s now and have been reading the comics since you were a teen or, like me, even earlier, you've been a fan of the world Penders and Bollers built. I was a massive fan of the Knuckles series from age seven to it's cancellation, and started reading Sonic with issue 52, up to just before the book really became a train wreck. It just started getting too dramatic to me, playing more like an episode of Dawson's Creek than an adventure story. I was also getting into other comics by fellas like Chester Brown, Alan Moore, and Frank Miller. I actually love drama, but the way it was beginning to be handled was cheesy, and it just got worse after I was gone. Whenever I look at the issues I missed however, most of the really god-awful stuff (the slap, Tails weeping with fused-together fingers) was written by Karl Bollers, not Penders. Which leads me to the conclusion that despite it's faults, fans generally liked what Penders brought to the table. I believe the backlash is mainly due to his shifty business practices, poor treatment of fans and professionals, the lawsuit, and perceived arrogance. Ian Flynn was on clean-up duty after Penders and Bollers left the book, but most of the characters he redeemed were messed up by Bollers, not Penders. Penders even revealed that if he hadn't been fired, a lot of what he was planning to do was cleaning up after Bollers as well, re-deeming Sally and the like. So I do think the long-time fans do (or at least once did) enjoy Penders' contributions more than they admit. I think the fans who want things to stay as they are now are generally those that got into the comics after Flynn established their current tone. And Flynn's reboot is a really good comic from what I've read. In fact, it's a lot better than I expected it to be. Is it exactly what I'd want out of a Sonic book? No, I'm someone who grew up on the Bollers-era, and despite my criticisms of his work, I really like a lot of what he did. I just think he took it too far. But Flynn's doing a good book, and I get why people who were introduced to this version of the series don't want to see it change.

I'm in my twenties, but I'm kinda a late reader. I started out reading the series during Ian's run, which brought back the fun memories I had of playing the games and watching the TV series. Curious for more, I decided to check out the earlier issues and catch up with everything going on. Most of it was stuff I'm indifferent towards. Where Bollers' writing was more controversial, Penders' stories were just plain boring. The stories were really dry, hardly anything happened in them, the dialogue was blah, and nearly all his characters looked alike. And the more I analyzed his stories, the worse they seem to become. Compared to Bollers, Penders was just lacking and uninteresting.