564 replies to this topic

[Alextendo]

Well, Antoine is surround by english people. My guess is he's not speaking french since he don't have the occasion to speak with anyone with his native language.

 

It's more or less like me for exemple: i'm surround with english speaking people. I could speak in french if i want, but nobody will understand. So what's the point? I could do only for occasion, but overall i don't see the point.

[TheRedStranger]

Well, Antoine is surround by english people. My guess is he's not speaking french since he don't have the occasion to speak with anyone with his native language.

 

It's more or less like me for exemple: i'm surround with english speaking people. I could speak in french if i want, but nobody will understand. So what's the point? I could do only for occasion, but overall i don't see the point.

 

In real life when people are troubled they have a tendency to revert to their native language due the stress-reaction. That could explain why I have heard him actually speak French phrases like "n'est ce pa" and "mon ami" in various episodes. Antoine is troubled almost all the time, reverting to his native language could be a coping mechanism.

[Hammer]

Think of the implications of that...you are fully aware of your actions but unable to do anything about it. Paralyzed in your own numb and metallic body .Fridge horror at it's finest.

Fellow TV Troper here?

About all the Antoine stuff

Who tells us that there isn't a remnant of the original Earth cultures in Mobius? What if Antoine and his family came from a different part of the planet where the French language (or at least some expressions and an accent) have been preserved?

 

I'd also like to point that his French may be toned down because of the unfamiliarity English speakers may have with it. I used to watch the series in Spanish and Antoine switched to French more often, but mostly saying this that were easily understood because of the similarities. For example, I hear Antoine in English adressing Sally as "my princess" but in Spanish he always said "ma princesse".

[TheRedStranger]

 

Think of the implications of that...you are fully aware of your actions but unable to do anything about it. Paralyzed in your own numb and metallic body .Fridge horror at it's finest.

Fellow TV Troper here?

About all the Antoine stuff

Who tells us that there isn't a remnant of the original Earth cultures in Mobius? What if Antoine and his family came from a different part of the planet where the French language (or at least some expressions and an accent) have been preserved?

 

I'd also like to point that his French may be toned down because of the unfamiliarity English speakers may have with it. I used to watch the series in Spanish and Antoine switched to French more often, but mostly saying this that were easily understood because of the similarities. For example, I hear Antoine in English adressing Sally as "my princess" but in Spanish he always said "ma princesse".

 

 

You could say that I am quite genre savy, as a writer I believe it's good to know your tropes (and how to subvert and avert them). When it comes to troping, let's just say I'm crazy prepared.

 

 Sí, español y francés son muy similares.

Et oui française est très semblable à l'espagnol.

 

You could do a lot more with simple cognates in the diologue due to their shared Latin-roots) depicting to the attended audience of Antoine's lingual foriegness in Spanish.  

[Prince ByTor]

In Spyhog Snively says he is from "The Dom Provance," (I just phonetically spelled it, so it's probably wrong), which I think is a part of Max's kingdom that is Francophone. Take Canada for instance: the two dominant languages are English and French, however as you get up into Quebec it's almost entirely Francophone. A nation can definitely have more than one language.

[Alextendo]

In Spyhog Snively says he is from "The Dom Provance," (I just phonetically spelled it, so it's probably wrong), which I think is a part of Max's kingdom that is Francophone. Take Canada for instance: the two dominant languages are English and French, however as you get up into Quebec it's almost entirely Francophone. A nation can definitely have more than one language.

I second that! I live in Quebec and my native language is french!

 

[SonicAaliyahFan]

Roboticization. How does it work?

This one caught my attention haha so i'll put my 2 cents in.

 

Like Uncle Chuck said in Blast to the Past, roboticization was originally designed to let people live longer. So he probably discovered a type of metal that can be as an alternative for organic matter and somehow figured out how it can transform the body from organic to metallic with the Mobian still being alive. This metal could also be strong and rust-proof, making the Mobian strong and sturdy inside-out, thus having a prolonged life. That also explains why Uncle Chuck never aged more since he was first roboticized.

 

And after seeing some roboticizations in SATam i noticed the roboticizer gives off an electrical glow. Maybe this glow contains particles of this "living" metal and when enveloping the body it emits these tiny particles into the organic parts and then transforms them into the metal piece by piece. I'm sure the Mobian would have some side effects too, like dizziness, probably some soreness due to the fact it has a new body and it's trying to get used to it. And apparently it'd still be able to eat organic foods and such, cause Uncle Chuck ate a chilidog in Spy Hog. Just cause the digestive system is robotic doesn't mean it's lost its function to break down food haha. The heart could be different though, maybe it doesn't operate like a heart. It could act like a digital battery or something.

 

That's my so-called point-of-view about how the roboticizer could work haha, i'd say more but i'm getting kinda tired now from all the typing i did.

[Alextendo]

For the robotization, there is many sort of metal out there....but what kind of metal it could be? Is there any metal that share similar property to flesh? Also, what kind of energy could affect the flesh in a way to make it turn into metal?

 

My take on this is that the energy beem from the robotizer affect the DNA. The DNA is in many way our...how can i say that?..more or less like our structure coding. When altered, it change the programmation of how the body work (therefore, the DNA structure). It's the only way it could be possible! But i guess it cannot be enough to turn entirely flesh to metal. Something else must to be used in order to complete the process...but what it could be?

[TheRedStranger]

For the robotization, there is many sort of metal out there....but what kind of metal it could be? Is there any metal that share similar property to flesh? Also, what kind of energy could affect the flesh in a way to make it turn into metal?

 

My take on this is that the energy beem from the robotizer affect the DNA. The DNA is in many way our...how can i say that?..more or less like our structure coding. When altered, it change the programmation of how the body work (therefore, the DNA structure). It's the only way it could be possible! But i guess it cannot be enough to turn entirely flesh to metal. Something else must to be used in order to complete the process...but what it could be?

 

 DNA (assuming Mobian's are "life as we know it") runs on a complex system of not binary, not trinary, but quatrinary structure, composing an elaborate structure of 100 trillion cells that are compeletly rewritten every 10 years of life). This is structured by RNA and elaborate series of complex protiens that both read the language and write incoming material into it's structure. Roboticization would best work either really fast or really gradual as to not cause total organ failure. Ferritization could be a semi-supernatural process mixed with science to gain it's non-lethal and will-draining effect. The only way I could make sense of an energy source converting someone this quick into whole new complex form would be magictech (quantum mechanics just doesn't work that way!). However if  nanomachines are involved an excellerated conversion process could be probable, but why not just unleash the nanos in The Great Forest and infect the Freedom Fighter's that way via an aresol, or have Robians carry them like a zombie-virus? That's what I would do. There could be flaws in my plan, though. Care to spot them out?

 

It is a code-language intellgently and brilliantly designed better than any supercomputer. You would have to map out the whole genome of each sub-species of Mobian (which would takes years of hard science) and programing to have the process so effective that it keeps the victim alive afterwards. 

 

 I tell you it's amazing studying this stuff in real life. Fun fact: If you wrote out the code on paper it would take up to 300 copies-worth of the whole Encyclopedia Brittanica from Tome A to Tome Z! The famous geneticist Anthony Flew (the former leader on the Human Genome Project which mapped out the whole human-code)  abandoned years of harsh skepticism and delved into theistic philosophy afterwards. It goes to show that science can crush doubts as much as it can shake your faith. Preconceptions of all kinds seem to wilt in the presence of truth, for it resists simplicity.

[Hammer]

Sí, español y francés son muy similares.
Et oui française est très semblable à l'espagnol.
 
You could do a lot more with simple cognates in the diologue due to their shared Latin-roots) depicting to the attended audience of Antoine's lingual foriegness in Spanish.

You more or less got them  The first one would be:
Sí, el español y el francés son muy parecidos/similares. (yours isn't really wrong, but it sounds more natural this way)
And the second one would be:
Et oui, le français est très semblable à l'espagnol. (Alextendo can correct me if I'm wrong)

[Alextendo]

Et oui, le français est très semblable à l'espagnol. (Alextendo can correct me if I'm wrong)

Mon espagnol fait vraiment pitié, donc je ne peux pas vraiment m'avancer sur le sujet. Mais je dirais que oui, il semble avoir effectivement de nombreuses similarité entre les deux langue.

 

Okay fine, i'll translate for those who might don't understand:

My spanish is extremely poor, so i can't really tell. But i would say that yes, it seem these two language share many things in common.

[brmsort]

Let's see.... a few interesting ones here I would like to take a crack at. I don't read the comics, so I can only base my opinions on the show.

 

The Great War.

 

I have not fully developed all the details of this in my head, but I think it was a false flag operation by Julian. With a military of entirely robots, it would be easy for him to start a false war. SatAM never gives any details about Sally's mom, so here is a very rudimentary thought on it. Julian found and began experimenting with the Roboticizer. Somehow, unfortunately, the Queen became aware of his autrocities, and he roboticized her. He then hid her, blamed her disappearance on some faction, and started the War. This would allow him to continue his experiments and build up the army until he was ready.

 

Roboticization

 

I agree that it is done by nanomachines. But instead of fully converting flesh to metal, they work with the biology a la cyborg. Power rings have the ability to distrupt function for a fime, returning freedom of will. The failed deroboticizer in Knothole could deactivate the nanites for a time, but they revert to their original programing after a time. I also suspect that there is a massive transmitter that Robotnik uses to maintain the stability of the nanite programming, which makes it hard to deroboticize anyone once the nanites are implanted.

 

French Antoine

 

I don't believe the rest of the Freedom Fighters are actually speaking English, especially since the writing as seen on the show is *rarely* English. As a watcher of anime, I consider any "English" seen or heard in SatAM is merely dubbing and localizing. As such Antoine is not really speaking French, but the closest human equivalent is French. This would be similar to how Osakans in anime are sometimes given a Southern-esque way of speaking when dubbed in English, since Osakans are seen a the rednecks of Japan.

[Prince ByTor]

 DNA (assuming Mobian's are "life as we know it") runs on a complex system of not binary, not trinary, but quatrinary structure, composing an elaborate structure of 100 trillion cells that are compeletly rewritten every 10 years of life). This is structured by RNA and elaborate series of complex protiens that both read the language and write incoming material into it's structure. Roboticization would best work either really fast or really gradual as to not cause total organ failure. Ferritization could be a semi-supernatural process mixed with science to gain it's non-lethal and will-draining effect. The only way I could make sense of an energy source converting someone this quick into whole new complex form would be magictech (quantum mechanics just doesn't work that way!). However if  nanomachines are involved an excellerated conversion process could be probable, but why not just unleash the nanos in The Great Forest and infect the Freedom Fighter's that way via an aresol, or have Robians carry them like a zombie-virus? That's what I would do. There could be flaws in my plan, though. Care to spot them out?

 

From what I saw on the cartoon it is short-range; each and every Mobian that got robotisized was in a chamber and got zapped with the beam, which turned them into robots. So if he was going to just robotize the Great Forest he'd have to build a much, much bigger one, which not be feasible. I think that would get noticed by the Freedom Fighters, who would sabotage/destroy it.

I notice a lot of people want to liken this to the Borg from Star Trek, where they used nanites to initiate the assimilation process then finish it off by actual surgical implants. The difference is that the Borg are cyborgs: half organic and half synthetic; each relying on the other. In the case of Robotisized Mobians they become purely robots without any organic components even though they started out being fully organic. It seems like it does it on the molecular (or even lower) level literally transforming tissues and cells into metal, but still carrying out the same tasks as it did when it was flesh and blood. If I am guessing it might be a matter-energy-matter transmuter, or something of the sort.

[brmsort]

 

From what I saw on the cartoon it is short-range; each and every Mobian that got robotisized was in a chamber and got zapped with the beam, which turned them into robots.

 

 

Uncle Chuck reverted to his robotic form in Rotor's workshop, away from any roboticizer. I would tend to agree with your opinion, except for that scene. That is why I tend to think of it as a nano-machine process.

[Prince ByTor]

 

 

From what I saw on the cartoon it is short-range; each and every Mobian that got robotisized was in a chamber and got zapped with the beam, which turned them into robots.

 

 

Uncle Chuck reverted to his robotic form in Rotor's workshop, away from any roboticizer. I would tend to agree with your opinion, except for that scene. That is why I tend to think of it as a nano-machine process.

 

 

Nanomachines could definitely be part of the process, but there could be also be a residual matter transmution energy surrounding the tissues and cells sending them back to their new matrix, if you will.

With both Uncle Chuck and Bunny we saw it happen all at once from the feet up, exactly like the robotisizer process; if nanites were the cause of their reverting without the robotizer I would expect to see it gradually happen, unless they work insanely fast. If it was only nanites that cause the process then there is nothing stopping Robotnik from seeding the atmosphere with them. It would only be a matter of time before all of the organic life breathed them in and/or ingested enough of them that they all would become robots. He wouldn't even have to "launch a vehicle" to do it; he could just have them crawl/blow out of the factory.

 

Anyway, to me the process would be like this:

Organic(old state)--matter transmute-->Metal(new state).

When they tried to derobotisize Bunny and Chuck: Metal----matter transmute without full knowledge---back to old organic state, it reverted back to new metal "base state."

If their derobotisizer was nanite only based I believe they would use nanites as part of the process or just reprogram the old ones and you think the old nanites rerobotizing them would've been detected.

 

Anyway, I might be off and I don't think the robotization process was ever full established. But just looking at the robotisizer makes me think of Star Trek's transporter, which is Matter----Energy----Matter and is fully explained although impractical. I can't help but think the transporter was part of the imagining of the robotisizer.

[Marble Didymus]

NEW QUESTION.

 

So Robotnik has a heart attack, and he falls over on Snively and crushes him to death.

 

The freedom fighters win.

 

Yay?

 

No, their troubles are only beginning.

 

They're now stuck with a planet stuck in a decade long decay. What happens then? Where do they go from there? There are all kinds of bad ways this could go. Look at the situation with the uprisings in the Middle East, see how those have played out. I know at one point Sir Charles mentions that Robians see and know what happens around them, just that they can't do anything about the situation. To me, that would be worrying. Especially if they're able to communicate somehow. Eleven years (and counting) is a long time to give thought to something like, say, "What happens when I get the freedom to wring the necks of the people who allowed this to happen?", or "How are we going to throw the incompetant royals out on their ass when we get out of this?" I would be shocked if Sally ever got to sit on the throne of Mobius when all is said and done.

[Prince ByTor]

NEW QUESTION.

 

So Robotnik has a heart attack, and he falls over on Snively and crushes him to death.

 

The freedom fighters win.

 

Yay?

 

No, their troubles are only beginning.

 

They're now stuck with a planet stuck in a decade long decay. What happens then? Where do they go from there? There are all kinds of bad ways this could go. Look at the situation with the uprisings in the Middle East, see how those have played out. I know at one point Sir Charles mentions that Robians see and know what happens around them, just that they can't do anything about the situation. To me, that would be worrying. Especially if they're able to communicate somehow. Eleven years (and counting) is a long time to give thought to something like, say, "What happens when I get the freedom to wring the necks of the people who allowed this to happen?", or "How are we going to throw the incompetant royals out on their ass when we get out of this?" I would be shocked if Sally ever got to sit on the throne of Mobius when all is said and done.

 

"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance"

 

It really depends on how bad the world was prior to the coup d'etat. How well did the Mobians live under King Max's reign? If all things are equal and there is no other outside influence I could see the Mobians splitting into many factions. However, with all of the pollution and destruction in the world I would expect to see one or more strong leaders to emerge; most likely one of them would be from the House of Acorns. It probably would turn into a civil war, which would be fought over what resources remained. And also don't forget about the robotisized citizens; there is a good chance even after they are back to normal they will band together in a mistrust of those that escaped their purgatory. Again it would take a strong leader to pull them all together; there's a good chance of civil war.

[TheRedStranger]

 

NEW QUESTION.

 

So Robotnik has a heart attack, and he falls over on Snively and crushes him to death.

 

The freedom fighters win.

 

Yay?

 

No, their troubles are only beginning.

 

They're now stuck with a planet stuck in a decade long decay. What happens then? Where do they go from there? There are all kinds of bad ways this could go. Look at the situation with the uprisings in the Middle East, see how those have played out. I know at one point Sir Charles mentions that Robians see and know what happens around them, just that they can't do anything about the situation. To me, that would be worrying. Especially if they're able to communicate somehow. Eleven years (and counting) is a long time to give thought to something like, say, "What happens when I get the freedom to wring the necks of the people who allowed this to happen?", or "How are we going to throw the incompetant royals out on their ass when we get out of this?" I would be shocked if Sally ever got to sit on the throne of Mobius when all is said and done.

 

"The price of freedom is eternal vigilance"

 

It really depends on how bad the world was prior to the coup d'etat. How well did the Mobians live under King Max's reign? If all things are equal and there is no other outside influence I could see the Mobians splitting into many factions. However, with all of the pollution and destruction in the world I would expect to see one or more strong leaders to emerge; most likely one of them would be from the House of Acorns. It probably would turn into a civil war, which would be fought over what resources remained. And also don't forget about the robotisized citizens; there is a good chance even after they are back to normal they will band together in a mistrust of those that escaped their purgatory. Again it would take a strong leader to pull them all together; there's a good chance of civil war.

 

 

 I am already awnsering this question through this: http://sonicsatam.co...854#entry179620

[TheRedStranger]

Better question is... How can you call yourself the Freedom Fighters while trying to restore an absolute monarchy? I mean Max had the power to disband a whole military, no strong, democratic parliment would ever allow this.

[Uncle Ben]

Better question is... How can you call yourself the Freedom Fighters while trying to restore an absolute monarchy? I mean Max had the power to disband a whole military, no strong, democratic parliment would ever allow this.

 

Cause the people looked happy in Blast to the Past. There was no problems with the way Max ran the country by the looks of it. If they want to restore it to the way it was then he was doing something right