367 replies to this topic

[Uncle Ben]

That what i was saying

[RedAuthar]

I mean, if you ignore or avoid all the fans' wants, you'll drive them away.

However it must be done intelligently. You'd have to look at what they want and try to add it into the storyline, not make it the storyline.

[LaserX5]

You DO realize that Flynn, or any writer, be it in comics, TV or anything else have to stay away from listening to fans on how they should run the series, right? They aren't allowed to listen to fan ideas on how to do this and that because if they did, whats to stop said fans from saying "Hey, that was my idea! I want payment for thar!" and all the other troubles it can cause?

Do you have any proof that says Flynn can't listen to fan ideas?

It sounds like to me the way he talks about is that he doesn't WANT ANY FAN IDEAS.

And again, Lauren Faust did it with MLP fans, and did they sue her? No.

Besides, why would they sue if they're given credit for the idea? That's better than getting paid because their name is getting publicity.

I mean, if you ignore or avoid all the fans' wants, you'll drive them away.

However it must be done intelligently. You'd have to look at what they want and try to add it into the storyline, not make it the storyline.

Best post I've read today.

While you can't implement everything fans want, they have to at least give them an ear and listen.

[furrykef]

So why can't Ian do the same? His reasons make absolutely no sense. "Oh, I can't because I might get sued for using someone else's idea."

Someone else's idea that the fans want you to use, Flynn.

Just because they say they want him to use it doesn't mean they can't sue him anyway. Flynn's right, I'm afraid -- people wouldn't use that as an "excuse" if it didn't actually happen.

And Laura Faust herself refuses to read fanfiction because she doesn't want to get any ideas from it for exactly the same reason Flynn doesn't want to listen to ideas.

Besides, why would they sue if they're given credit for the idea? That's better than getting paid because their name is getting publicity.

Picture somebody maliciously baiting a creator into using their idea and then suing when he does. People are bastards, and that's something you always have to keep in mind when you get into business. True, most people aren't so malicious, but it only takes one guy to ruin somebody's career. Better not to take the chance.

Not to mention that a would-be grateful fan might suddenly get dollar signs in his eyes once he's confronted with the possibility of making some cash. It's easier to think "I won't sue" before your idea is used than after...

[ILOVEVHS]

I'm convinced that someone at SEGA was a furry, and wrote the kiss into 06, believing that that would be fan service.

[Uncle Ben]

Its still beastiality and necrofelism... someone at SEGA better have been fired for it

[LaserX5]

Just because they say they want him to use it doesn't mean they can't sue him anyway. Flynn's right, I'm afraid -- people wouldn't use that as an "excuse" if it didn't actually happen.

If Flynn gives them full credit for the idea, there is nothing to sue. What are they going to say, that Flynn stole the idea when he gave them credit on page one of the comic?

Yea, any judge would laugh them right out of the building.

Besides, Sonic is not their property. What can they sue for exactly when the series doesn't even belong to them to begin with?

And Laura Faust herself refuses to read fanfiction because she doesn't want to get any ideas from it for exactly the same reason Flynn doesn't want to listen to ideas.

Well, she used an idea from someone who drew MLP fanart of Spike belching up letters on.

That shows me she isn't exactly turning a complete blind eye to fan ideas.

Picture somebody maliciously baiting a creator into using their idea and then suing when he does. People are bastards, and that's something you always have to keep in mind when you get into business. True, most people aren't so malicious, but it only takes one guy to ruin somebody's career. Better not to take the chance.

Not to mention that a would-be grateful fan might suddenly get dollar signs in his eyes once he's confronted with the possibility of making some cash. It's easier to think "I won't sue" before your idea is used than after...

Again, there is nothing to sue. Sonic doesn't belong to them and as long as they give credit to the person who came up with the story idea, no judge would bother taking the case.

They would be suing for nothing.

[Uncle Ben]

You cant sue and idea unless its copywrite on it

[Prime]

You DO realize that Flynn, or any writer, be it in comics, TV or anything else have to stay away from listening to fans on how they should run the series, right? They aren't allowed to listen to fan ideas on how to do this and that because if they did, whats to stop said fans from saying "Hey, that was my idea! I want payment for thar!" and all the other troubles it can cause?

Do you have any proof that says Flynn can't listen to fan ideas?

It sounds like to me the way he talks about is that he doesn't WANT ANY FAN IDEAS.

And again, Lauren Faust did it with MLP fans, and did they sue her? No.

Besides, why would they sue if they're given credit for the idea? That's better than getting paid because their name is getting publicity.

Yeah, I do have proof actually. I've got myself a copy of the contract that Ian signed when he joined up with Archie. I'd show you it, but I've misplaced it in my vast collection of contracts I collect.

No seriously, it's the norm in the business that writers need to stay clear of fan ideas or fan fiction or fan whatevers because it can and has led to serious legal problems. Tends to be how things go I'm afraid. It has nothing to do with Flynn not wanting fan ideas, it's more about he can't.

Yeah you might get the odd fan who would be gladly pleased that their idea was used, but you do really think every single fan would be like that. No. No they wouldn't and they would want compensation for their idea being used. So why risk taking a fan's idea on the hope that they won't get all butthurt and go after them with legal action?

Listening to feedback is one thing, taking fan ideas is another. There's a difference in listening to fans say "bring back this character!" compared to "do this as a story idea!" If fans latch onto a character and what to see more of that character and such, yeah, the creative team will give fans something like that. But to say this Lauren Faust listened to fans for story ideas is highly doubtful, sitting there listening to some fan prattle on about the "bestest idea for an episode ever" and then take that idea. There is a reason that comic companies, TV producers and all that always send back fan produced scripts without having read them, because they aren't allowed to.

But what do I know? Clearly reading about these things before and having spoken to people who have worked in comics, television and movies, isn't enough, I suppose I need solid proof, do I? Clearly you know better then I do on how the these industrues are run.

Funny and true story. Once upon a time, a writer for Marvel by the name of Peter David who was approached by a fan and that fan gave him an idea for a Fantastic Four story based off something that had recently happened in the comic. Peter thought the idea could work and went to his editor asking if the fan could submit a pitch for the story. The editor told him that another writer was in the middle of writing a script with the same basic concept for a story. But the editor had this fan's name which would be useful for future submissions just in case. You could say this fan had his foot in the door.

So the comic gets published and guess what happened? Turns out the fan had a brother. A brother who was a lawyer. And the lawyer was convinced that Marvel were stealing his brother's ideas. Marvel got sued. The editor and some others had to defend themselves legally (Marvel wouldn't foot the bill) and had to prove the story that was published was actually commissioned and work on it was produced before Peter David had come into contact with this fan. They were successful, but the whole thing was a long and unnecessary process. The fan had gotten himself worst possible reputation in the comic industry, so he was never able to find any employment within a very close-knit community. Because of this, Marvel has a policy to avoid unsolicited ideas.


Want another one? Here you go!

Scott Allie of Dark Horse told a story once. A fan came up to him with a clever idea for a Buffy the Vampire Slayer story. Allie liked it so much that he asked the fan to turn it into a script. Guess what happened? The script sucked. As Allie said, the fan couldn’t write dialogue for shit.. So Dark Horse wasn’t able to use the script. And now they have to avoid ever publishing anything similar, because there’s the potential for a lawsuit.

So yeah, I think I know what I'm talking about.

[Uncle Ben]

But Prime those are two cases that turned out sour. (As much as i hate the brand and i cant believe im gonna use it as an example) MLP used some Fan ideas and they never got any bad heat from it

[Prime]

But Prime those are two cases that turned out sour. (As much as i hate the brand and i cant believe im gonna use it as an example) MLP used some Fan ideas and they never got any bad heat from it

Yeah, there's a difference is throwing in something like an easter egg for fans. The makers of X-Men: The Last Stand didn't get sued for having the Juggernaut say "Don't you know who I am? I'M THE JUGGERNAUT, BITCH!" because that was thrown in for fans who would get the nod. That was a tiny thing that wasn't central to the plot of the movie, just a funny little moment to pay homage to the "Juggernaut Bitch" videos on youtube.

A tiny easter egg isn't going to be a big deal . Taking a fans idea for a story is a big deal. A big deal that can caused trouble.

[Uncle Ben]

As long as they give credit they should use fan input if its a story

[Prime]

As long as they give credit they should use fan input if its a story

Helllllllo? Credit isn't enough, you think every single fan is gonna be okay with credit? You think they'll be all "Hey! That story idea I gave them sure was popular! Gee, it's been reprinted a whole bunch of times! I'm so glad and happy with my credit because I don't need any of that vast cash flow that's going towards the comic company!" What's to stop a fan who said they'd be fine with it one day and then want a slice of the cash later on? They will not risk it.

[Uncle Ben]

Thats the problem with i have with the world... "Hey My idea gets published and it made millions... i want a slice of that." Hell if it was my story i wouldnt care. If i got credit for the story i wouldnt care. My name would get out there and hell if the writer gets fired they could call me up and offer his old position. Its getting your name out there is what i would care about not the i want x% of the profit

[LaserX5]

Yeah, I do have proof actually. I've got myself a copy of the contract that Ian signed when he joined up with Archie. I'd show you it, but I've misplaced it in my vast collection of contracts I collect.

You're not funny in the least, man, so quit trying to be.

No seriously, it's the norm in the business that writers need to stay clear of fan ideas or fan fiction or fan whatevers because it can and has led to serious legal problems. Tends to be how things go I'm afraid. It has nothing to do with Flynn not wanting fan ideas, it's more about he can't.

Then Flynn should have talked about it like a professional instead of acting like a yutz , answering it off with, "Nopsies!"

Ugh, how immature on his part...

Yeah you might get the odd fan who would be gladly pleased that their idea was used, but you do really think every single fan would be like that. No. No they wouldn't and they would want compensation for their idea being used. So why risk taking a fan's idea on the hope that they won't get all butthurt and go after them with legal action?

Fine, I suppose some would be dumb enough to sue, but it would be completely stupid.

I don't see how any judge with common sense would think they're entitled to any money when the series is not even their property to begin with.

Listening to feedback is one thing, taking fan ideas is another. There's a difference in listening to fans say "bring back this character!" compared to "do this as a story idea!" If fans latch onto a character and what to see more of that character and such, yeah, the creative team will give fans something like that. But to say this Lauren Faust listened to fans for story ideas is highly doubtful, sitting there listening to some fan prattle on about the "bestest idea for an episode ever" and then take that idea. There is a reason that comic companies, TV producers and all that always send back fan produced scripts without having read them, because they aren't allowed to.

So you're saying there's literally a rule out there that says using fan ideas are prohibited?

But what do I know? Clearly reading about these things before and having spoken to people who have worked in comics, television and movies, isn't enough, I suppose I need solid proof, do I? Clearly you know better then I do on how the these industries are run.

Tell me, do you get a feeling of superiority acting all sarcastic and uppity with me because I asked for tangible proof?

I suppose wanting to see clear evidence if possible is too much to ask, am I right?

Funny and true story. Once upon a time, a writer for Marvel by the name of Peter David who was approached by a fan and that fan gave him an idea for a Fantastic Four story based off something that had recently happened in the comic. Peter thought the idea could work and went to his editor asking if the fan could submit a pitch for the story. The editor told him that another writer was in the middle of writing a script with the same basic concept for a story. But the editor had this fan's name which would be useful for future submissions just in case. You could say this fan had his foot in the door.

So the comic gets published and guess what happened? Turns out the fan had a brother. A brother who was a lawyer. And the lawyer was convinced that Marvel were stealing his brother's ideas. Marvel got sued. The editor and some others had to defend themselves legally (Marvel wouldn't foot the bill) and had to prove the story that was published was actually commissioned and work on it was produced before Peter David had come into contact with this fan. They were successful, but the whole thing was a long and unnecessary process. The fan had gotten himself worst possible reputation in the comic industry, so he was never able to find any employment within a very close-knit community. Because of this, Marvel has a policy to avoid unsolicited ideas.


Want another one? Here you go!

Scott Allie of Dark Horse told a story once. A fan came up to him with a clever idea for a Buffy the Vampire Slayer story. Allie liked it so much that he asked the fan to turn it into a script. Guess what happened? The script sucked. As Allie said, the fan couldn't’t write dialogue for shit.. So Dark Horse wasn’t able to use the script. And now they have to avoid ever publishing anything similar, because there’s the potential for a lawsuit.

That guy really won the case? Sheesh, judges can be such idiots.

Then again, why should I be surprised? They overturn legislations a community voted on because it's "unconstitutional."

Morons...

So yeah, I think I know what I'm talking about.

That doesn't mean you're better than me, so quit acting like you are.

[Prime]

Thats the problem with i have with the world... "Hey My idea gets published and it made millions... i want a slice of that." Hell if it was my story i wouldnt care. If i got credit for the story i wouldnt care. My name would get out there and hell if the writer gets fired they could call me up and offer his old position. Its getting your name out there is what i would care about not the i want x% of the profit

And the best way to do that is to actually get ties into the industry and keep at it. Just going up to someone you don't know and giving them your idea and hoping they use it isn't really going to work in this day and age.

You're not funny in the least, man, so quit trying to be.

Really? That's odd because I've been told I'm funny from plenty of people! keep in mind most of those people don't live in fantasy land and think they know how a comic book should be run.

Then Flynn should have talked about it like a professional instead of acting like a yutz , answering it off with, "Nopsies!"


Ugh, how immature on his part...

Yeah, because he clearly can't have any fun at all. He has to be super duper serious!

Fine, I suppose some would be dumb enough to sue, but it would be completely stupid.

I don't see how any judge with common sense would think they're entitled to any money when the series is not even their property to begin with.

No, it's not stupid, it's completely fucking logical. There's nothing dumb about people wanting to be PAID for their work and ideas.

So you're saying there's literally a rule out there that says using fan ideas are prohibited?

More or less, yeah! And you know what? It's been in effect for years! This isn't something they just suddenly come up with!

Tell me, do you get a feeling of superiority acting all sarcastic and uppity with me because I asked for tangible proof?

No, not at all! But I do get a raging boner when I know what I'm talking about to someone who doesn't.

I suppose wanting to see clear evidence if possible is too much to ask, am I right?

This coming from the guy who assumes Ian Flynn hates the SatAM cast, hates this, hates that, hates everything and constantly goes on about it without a lick of proof.

That guy really won the case? Sheesh, judges can be such idiots.

Then again, why should I be surprised? They overturn legislations a community voted on because it's "unconstitutional."

Morons...

Not he didn't win the case, because I stated the editor and the others were successful in proving they had work on this idea before meeting the fan. Marvel was brought to court and was going to be sued because of it, but weren't actually sued as far as I remember.

That doesn't mean you're better than me, so quit acting like you are.

Not saying I am better then you, I just know what I'm taking about. And my raging boner agrees with me.

[LaserX5]

You know, the one thing I don't get is if companies are so worried about being sued, then why don't they make anyone who wants an idea implemented into their series to sign an official document stating once their idea is accepted, they forfeit any rights to it and cannot sue.

Seems to me that would solve alot of this so called, "Oh, I can't take your idea because we'd get sued." crap.

[LaserX5]

Really? That's odd because I've been told I'm funny from plenty of people! keep in mind most of those people don't live in fantasy land and think they know how a comic book should be run.

As if I really care about any of that when you act all smart aleck with someone who merely asking honest questions...

Yeah, because he clearly can't have any fun at all. He has to be super duper serious!

He does in matters like these. This is fan ideas and the potential of lawsuits he's talking about. That is nothing to joke around about.

No, it's not stupid, it's completely fucking logical. There's nothing dumb about people wanting to be PAID for their work and ideas.

Except for the fact the material they're writing about doesn't belong to them. If anything, being paid should be considered a privilege, not a right.

More or less, yeah! And you know what? It's been in effect for years! This isn't something they just suddenly come up with!

Then why don't you show us a link about it so we can all see it for ourselves, O knowledgeable one?

No, not at all! But I do get a raging boner when I know what I'm talking about to someone who doesn't.

Uh huh...

Not exactly a good trait to have if you ask me.

This coming from the guy who assumes Ian Flynn hates the SatAM cast, hates this, hates that, hates everything and constantly goes on about it without a lick of proof.

It was my opinion, OK? Do you understand anything about opinion? I never said it was absolute fact, so quit acting like I was.

You were giving your opinion too about this whole thing, and yet I didn't rail on you about it.

Not he didn't win the case, because I stated the editor and the others were successful in proving they had work on this idea before meeting the fan. Marvel was brought to court and was going to be sued because of it, but weren't actually sued as far as I remember.

I see...

Not saying I am better then you, I just know what I'm taking about. And my raging boner agrees with me.

Then why don't you use some class then when showing your "superior intellect."

I'd take you more seriously then.

[FunnelVortex]

Really? That's odd because I've been told I'm funny from plenty of people! keep in mind most of those people don't live in fantasy land and think they know how a comic book should be run.

As if I really care about any of that when you act all smart aleck with someone who merely asking honest questions...

Yeah, because he clearly can't have any fun at all. He has to be super duper serious!

He does in matters like these. This is fan ideas and the potential of lawsuits he's talking about. That is nothing to joke around about.

No, it's not stupid, it's completely fucking logical. There's nothing dumb about people wanting to be PAID for their work and ideas.

Except for the fact the material they're writing about doesn't belong to them. If anything, being paid should be considered a privilege, not a right.

More or less, yeah! And you know what? It's been in effect for years! This isn't something they just suddenly come up with!

Then why don't you show us a link about it so we can all see it for ourselves, O knowledgeable one?

No, not at all! But I do get a raging boner when I know what I'm talking about to someone who doesn't.

Uh huh...

Not exactly a good trait to have if you ask me.

This coming from the guy who assumes Ian Flynn hates the SatAM cast, hates this, hates that, hates everything and constantly goes on about it without a lick of proof.

It was my opinion, OK? Do you understand anything about opinion? I never said it was absolute fact, so quit acting like I was.

You were giving your opinion too about this whole thing, and yet I didn't rail on you about it.

Not he didn't win the case, because I stated the editor and the others were successful in proving they had work on this idea before meeting the fan. Marvel was brought to court and was going to be sued because of it, but weren't actually sued as far as I remember.

I see...

Not saying I am better then you, I just know what I'm taking about. And my raging boner agrees with me.

Then why don't you use some class then when showing your "superior intellect."

I'd take you more seriously then.

This guy is just being an idiot, bro.

[Uncle Ben]

Hey guys play nice