636 replies to this topic

[Uncle Ben]

Her outfit makes her look like she's going snowboarding

Now that i look at it again it does look like it

[Gojira007]

I know. This is why i hate our day and age. Can we go back to a time like the 50's (with todays technology of course) where no one cared and everything was hunky-doory and everyone knew everyone

OK, I don't want to overly-politicize this thread, but that's some DEEPLY problematic thinking right there. >_O;

That said, I agree with others who are slightly discomforted at the extent to which Sal's new design reinforces the insulting double-standard of Sonic character design.

[fishtheimpaler]

DON'T WORRY FANS SHE'LL BE BACK TO NORMAL

WE WOULDN'T WANT TO INFLICT THE SLIGHTEST AMOUNT OF SUSPENSE OR SURPRISE UPON YOU

*shrugs* she's been in robot form for so long maybe nobody has thought that realistically she could return to normal. In which case, this was a taster of sorts, a teaser to get people excited.

You know, it took me a while to realize what exactly was so depressing about this statement, but I think I've got it.

For all these characters, roboticization is the quintessential Fate Worse Than Death. They've been fighting against this madman whose goal is to enslave the entire population, and when he gets you he turns you against your friends, while you get to watch. It's a vampire/zombie/pod person mechanic.

So one character--a politically and socially central one who has been on and off the love interest of the chief protagonist--subjects herself to this Fate Worse Than Death to save the rest of the planet, and now her friends have to combat her, knowing that every blow they strike is a blow against their imprisoned friend.

And this whole situation has become SO BORING that it's potentially an interesting, buzz-building move to just up and tell the readership "yeah, she's going to escape and everything will be okay again," because the readers will be more excited about a possible change in a character's outfit than worried about whether one of them will be a slave forever, die a slave, kill her friends, etc.

I don't care who you are, that's just some bad, bad writing.

[Prime]

Not to sound like a major dick or anything, but I have been laughing at some of the more serious rage responses to this whole redesign thing, not on here, but around the web.

Redesigning a character in a comic is nothing new, not even to the Sonic comic. While some of these redesigns were obvious, like changing Sonic, Tails, Amy, aka ALL the video game cast to resemble the new redesigned looks of Sonic Adventure back in the day, SatAM/comic cast members have under gone redesigns too, like Bunnie, Rotor, Fiona.

And the one who has probably undergone the most changes? Sally:

.Lets go all the way back to the original mini-series, #0 and we got the orange Sally with blond hair. We all know THAT one didn't stick around for long and since then has only popped up one in a flashback (to retcon it) and on the cover of The Beginning trade paperback as a nod.
.So then in #1 of the mini-series, Sally is in her pilot episodes colors, the pink fur and black hair look.That one was around for 18 issues.
.Come issue #16, she's what would become her standard season 2 look. ON the cover that is. In the actual issue Sally is rocking her season 1 look. Again this one only lasts one issue.
.Issue #17 she's in her season 2 look. And that has been the longest standing design for her.
.But come issue #130, Sally has been redesigned and now has long hair. This look stuck around for 47 issues before Sally was back to her old self, this redeisgn being the longest running one after her standard season 2 look.

And while it can be argued that since issue #17 the look has been kept the same bar her long hair, she's probably had more redesigns then any other character. Sure this most recent one is the most drastic because she's suddenly wearing clothes (RAGE!) But she still has the same look about her besides clothes. Her hair seems to have changed a little, but it's still has that Sally short look about it(and her hair is probably the most changed thing about her at this point) Her hair and fur colors remain unchanged and her new outfit retains the blue of her vest and boots while chucking in some white and black, because if this new outfit was in all blue, it'd be a lil bland.

While it seems more then likely this redesign has been brought about due to this whole roboticization arc. If she is sporting this new look the moment they change her back because of weaponizing thing Eggman did, I won't buy it. If she turns back to normal (aka her season 2 look) and changes into this outfit to reflect the whole ordeal she has gone through that has changed her in some way, I can deal with that.

In all fairness this thing has been dragging along and has served no real purpose currently, and it is looking like it's purpose has been to redesign her. I was all for it to start with, but Mecha Sally hasn't really been used effectively. All she seems to do is fight the heroes and retreat. That's all. OH! And she kidnapped Lupe and that feline character nobody cares about. That's it! Labelling Mecha Sally as the "greatest" threat Mobius has ever seen and then have her do nothing at all isn't selling me on the evil side of things. I guess the whole mass genocide thing that happened to the Echidna race when Eggman decided he wanted to become Hitler for a while is peanuts compared to Mecha Sally.

It'll be nice to have Sally back to normal because the redesign doesn't bother me. But if nothing happens with the Mecha Sally character between now and when they finally change her back, then this whole arc will have been most boring and unsuspenseful 12-18 odd months (since we still dunno when she'll change back. Some saying it'll happen after the crossover) the book has given us. Started off solid for a couple of issues and then fell flat on it's face.

[randomizer]

By my estimation, clothes being fused into an organic creature during the process of being converted at the cellular level to a machine makes more sense then new clothes being formed from body modifications post-deroboticization. And even with that aside, it'd still be a pretty convoluted justification for a costume change.

Perhaps it is just a complimentary outfit provided as a token of appreciation for participating in the robotics program. Yes, that sounds plausible.

[Teirusu]

Talking from all the ignorance of comics. I like the new design instead of the one in SatAM chapters. I don't know if there is more changes of the comics, but I see her more cute with clothes than without or with the blue false cloth. Is just my opinion

[Uncle Ben]

DON'T WORRY FANS SHE'LL BE BACK TO NORMAL

WE WOULDN'T WANT TO INFLICT THE SLIGHTEST AMOUNT OF SUSPENSE OR SURPRISE UPON YOU

*shrugs* she's been in robot form for so long maybe nobody has thought that realistically she could return to normal. In which case, this was a taster of sorts, a teaser to get people excited.

You know, it took me a while to realize what exactly was so depressing about this statement, but I think I've got it.

For all these characters, roboticization is the quintessential Fate Worse Than Death. They've been fighting against this madman whose goal is to enslave the entire population, and when he gets you he turns you against your friends, while you get to watch. It's a vampire/zombie/pod person mechanic.

So one character--a politically and socially central one who has been on and off the love interest of the chief protagonist--subjects herself to this Fate Worse Than Death to save the rest of the planet, and now her friends have to combat her, knowing that every blow they strike is a blow against their imprisoned friend.

And this whole situation has become SO BORING that it's potentially an interesting, buzz-building move to just up and tell the readership "yeah, she's going to escape and everything will be okay again," because the readers will be more excited about a possible change in a character's outfit than worried about whether one of them will be a slave forever, die a slave, kill her friends, etc.

I don't care who you are, that's just some bad, bad writing.

They really didnt think that out did they??

[PuffinGrandeur]

Actually the books haven't been billing her as an ultimate evil. That's pretty much been fan expectations from the Silver story.

[Uncle Ben]

You think she's trying to resist the roboticiazation?? like the robot part of her is in control but she fighting it?

[Gojira007]

A better quality image of the redesign has surfaced:

Not much different than what I expected from the previous, more washed-out image; generally speaking, I'm alright with it, though again it definitely feels like it's meant to get Sally more in-line with SEGA's "in-house" style. There IS one niggling detail I do NOT like at all, however, and that's Sally's newly-rounded cheeks; it shouldn't be that big a deal, but somehow the loss of Sally's little furry tufts on the sides of her face doesn't sit well with me, and I feel like it's the one element of the redesign that honestly just makes her new model feel more generic than the original.

On the plus side, the clearer outfit bears MUCH less of a resemblance to her Weaponized Mecha-Sally form, so hopefully they WON'T be making an explicit connection between the two after all.

(Credit to http://orbotooc.tumb...finally-given-i for the picture)

[Uncle Ben]

Yea i dont like the rounded cheeks either. The furry tuffs were better

[bwrosas]

Yea i dont like the rounded cheeks either. The furry tuffs were better

check out my two new vids on this subject on my YT channel (bwrosas) to hear more on it.

and the reason for the younger look, to reach the NEWER/YOUNGER GENERATION of fans that have just gotten into the games, thus also got into the comics.

[zelchias]

A better quality image of the redesign has surfaced:

Not much different than what I expected from the previous, more washed-out image; generally speaking, I'm alright with it, though again it definitely feels like it's meant to get Sally more in-line with SEGA's "in-house" style. There IS one niggling detail I do NOT like at all, however, and that's Sally's newly-rounded cheeks; it shouldn't be that big a deal, but somehow the loss of Sally's little furry tufts on the sides of her face doesn't sit well with me, and I feel like it's the one element of the redesign that honestly just makes her new model feel more generic than the original.

On the plus side, the clearer outfit bears MUCH less of a resemblance to her Weaponized Mecha-Sally form, so hopefully they WON'T be making an explicit connection between the two after all.

(Credit to http://orbotooc.tumb...finally-given-i for the picture)

I really, really hope that this is indeed the case, because given how disapointing this whole Mecha Sally thing turned out to be, her getting a new outfit from being mutilated would just be the icing on the cake. Granted, I'm not entirely fond of the idea that this could wind up the most lasting impact from the whole thing, but hey, at least it'll be over and maybe, just maybe, the ending can be amazing enough to salvage this bore of a storyline.

Though I gotta agree, her new look IS kinda generic.

Actually the books haven't been billing her as an ultimate evil. That's pretty much been fan expectations from the Silver story.

They HAVE been billing her as a major threat and something you should be very worried about, despite the fact that her track record in-comic has been abysmal, and any emotional impact from her has been muted and poorly condensed into only a few issues. Her debut promised great things, but thus far this entire plot point has been about as exciting as a fart in the wind, as have the majority of side plots that emerged since then.

[Uncle Ben]

Yea i dont like the rounded cheeks either. The furry tuffs were better

check out my two new vids on this subject on my YT channel (bwrosas) to hear more on it.

and the reason for the younger look, to reach the NEWER/YOUNGER GENERATION of fans that have just gotten into the games, thus also got into the comics.

ill do it later i got labs soon

[bwrosas]

it's not the first time a redesign to character has happen. Look at April in the last 3 seasons of the orginal TMNT Cartoon or heck even Charlie in the 2006 Biker Mice cartoon. Need I say more?

[ILOVEVHS]

EVERYONE! Calm down! It's a comic book! They have no logic! They have people who survive radiation, and make them mutate into green men! I understand that you all are huge Sonic fans. I am too! But you're over-analyzing! It's a COMIC!

[Captain Sorzo]

Now that a clear image is available, I can safely say that I dislike the design, which comes across as an attempt at Sega-fying a character who, more than anyone else, was the iconic representation of the Sonic franchise beyond the games. It's the massive hands and gloves that kill the design, really. They manage to feel both out of place and generic at the same time.

I'm mixed on the loss of the cheek tufts. They look great in SatAM, where they're subtle and actually look like fur, but in the comic as of late they're usually drawn as these massive...spikey....things that look much worse. Still, I'm going to likely miss them.

With that said, this is just a piece of concept art drawn by a single individual. Hopefully at least some of the artists will try to add back in a bit of classic flair by drawing minor cheek tufts, giving her proportionate hands, etc.

[PuffinGrandeur]

Sally's tiny hands are dumb anyway, honestly, I hate that people keep forcing those back in.

[fishtheimpaler]

Another story complaint: to the extent that this entire theoretically-dramatic plotline was primarily an excuse to change Sally's look: do you realize how easy it can be to motivate that?

Sean Catlett once pointed out to me how stupid Amy using the ring of acorns or whatever it was to wish herself to look on-game-model was. Want to motivate a costume change?
INTERLOCUTOR: Hey, Amy, new dress?
AMY: Yeah, I thought I was getting a little too old for that frock-and-skirt.
INTERLOCUTOR: Looks nice!
AMY: Thanks!
Next panel. This also has the advantage of subtly conveying her desire to grow up and be an co-equal to Sonic, rather than just a distant admirer.

Sally needs to lose her cheek tufts?
INTERLOCUTOR: Sally, trim your cheek fringe?
SALLY: Yeah. It always gets itchy in the spring, and I don't need to give people an extra way to grab me when I'm in combat.
INTERLOCUTOR: Looks nice!
SALLY: Thanks!
Again, simple devices like this can nicely tie in with character traits, such as Sally's long plotline of not wanting to be cooped up away from her friends and their fights.

IIRC, the book actually originally motivated one of Sally's costume changes this way, with the simple remark, "Huh! I could use some pockets!" when she put on her trademark mid-80s blue vest. Nice little touch, right?

This is goddamn ludicrous

[Gojira007]

I'm also kind of fond of Sally trimming her hair down as a symbolic acknowledgement of getting back into the thick of things post-"Eggman Empire". It made sense, it wasn't terribly belabored, and it fit the Arc of the overall story quite nicely. Likewise, the redesigns that occurred after "Tossed in Space" were at least logical by virtue of being an indication that time has seriously passed in Sonic's absence.
Otherwise, though, this Comic has a long and frustrating history of making overly-complicated and narratively-incoherent explanations for simple design shifts, which becomes all the more glaring when they just sort of decide not to bother; Sonic and Amy had fairly infamous stories to explain away their design change, while Tails and Knuckles just sort of started using their SA models with no notification apparently needed.

EDIT: Though again, another positive example is "Upgrade" as an explanation for Bunnie's new look. It's an effectively-written story with real emotional stakes to it, even as it was also meant to transition Bunnie into a new character design.