85 replies to this topic

[Jim Doe]

EXCELLENT dialogue for this page.

Thankya thankya.

Only one page left to go! I can feel S3 slipping from my clammy grasp! I . . . I think I'm gonna cry.

[J.E.Smith]

Only one page left to go! I can feel S3 slipping from my clammy grasp! I . . . I think I'm gonna cry.

Hang in there, Jim. You'll have it back in another twenty-five weeks (If the second arc is the same length as the first, that is).

[Glitcher]

I've been meaning to comment on this Sea3on short for a while now, were it not for Pokemon HeartGold sucking up my life.

Even though I was too late to apply for the first short, I was still pleased that veteran Sonic artist Carina Kadow was chosen to illustrate the comic. The excellent work she posted in her DA gallery speaks for itself. Indeed, the comic gets off to a strong start, featuring a superbly atmospheric shot of Robotropolis on a stormy night that touts her experience with B&W images. The foggy lights, splashes of rain and unobtrusive onomatopoeia are all nicely rendered. Sonic stands out well with his white robe in the darkened background, which helps makes the panels more readable despite the heavy lines. Although Sonic's design slips somewhat from the standard of the show, the single panel of Sally is highly faithful.
The artwork is not without criticism. For one thing, although the rain in the opening panel looks fantastic, the rest is plainly recycled and not scaled to the closeness of the shots. Even heavy rain is not as dense as it's depicted here, and it appears to have little contact with its surroundings. Sonic isn't even wet! It's clearly just a mix of Noise and Motion Blur filters, and the added blur even makes it look like snow. Secondly, the dialogue is HUGE! I don't know if Carina's screen resolution is set far above normal, but her font would be better off at half size.

About the writing, I find Jim Doe's script highly questionable. I have nothing against introspective short stories, but they work best when juxtaposed against the plot - the past serving as a lesson for the present. Even if Sonic is forced to wait in one spot for a few pages, some flashbacks could have been written to give the interrim some visual substance. (Or it could be Carina's fault for not illustrating them.) Perhaps Sonic's mission has some relevance to all his angsting on the final page, but for now I find his panic attack poorly-written and out of character. I seem to remember Sonic overflowing with confidence in the cartoon, yet here he appears even more spineless than Antoine. I guess I shouldn't judge Jim Doe too harshly. He's probably just a teenager going through an emo phase, and I admit I've written worse when I was younger. Still, I hope the story of the following short is as engaging as the main comic.

All in all, Waiting is the Hardest Part is a pretty comic let down by an overemotional script. A golf clap for Carina; a pat on the head for Jim Doe.

[chief]

Hahaha Jim is probably one of the oldest here. So.. No, he isn't a teenager going through a emo phase. To be honest I like seeing Sonic act as a misrable twat because I can't stand the fuck. I consider Sonic one of the worst characters for a comic or cartoon. But saying that I had nothing to do with this short, I actually never even read the script for this one I just like to pass stuff through without reading haha. But I did read the other two shorts and I'm excited for the second.


Sonic did seem a little emo but.. hey, every arragant twat needs to slit a wrist now and then.

[Jim Doe]

Heh, I'm one o' them 30 year old teenagers.

While Lady Chal did throw in a few of her own bits of flair into the visuals, it is all very much as I scripted it. There is a lack of flashbacks on purpose for two reasons. First, many if not all of the incidents that Sonic mentions that would be flashed back to are things that have already been seen by the vast majority of the audience a million times, as they all happen within the show itself, making a visual rehash somewhat pointless. And second, it isolates Sonic . . . the fact that he's the only one seen when he's recounting his failures reinforces that he considers them to be his failures alone. Showing flashbacks would bring up scenes in which other Freedom Fighters took part, thus showing that these failures were actually a part of a team effort, not just solely on his own shoulders like he thinks. As it stands, I think Lady Chal did a wonderful job of supplying plenty of visual substance to a basically static setting. The main focus of the reader should ideally be on Sonic's facial expressions and body language, which she handled superbly.

There is no information given on the actual nature of his overall mission for similar reasons. This short is set in between breaths, independent of the mission that bookends it except in that it is the reason he's waiting in the alleyway in the first place and the reason he picks himself back up at the end. Everything else about it besides its existence is irrelevant to that moment. Further, the purpose of the shorts as I understand them and as I personally intend them to be is that they are character pieces, delving into the minds and hearts of the characters, having them act to their own internal forces rather than react to external stimuli. They will not be "Sonic the Hero" or "Snively the Villain" or "Antoine the Comic Relief" so much as they are "Sonic the Person", "Snively the Human", and "Antoine the Regular Guy". The only time any substantial overarching plot, as it were, will be taking place within these shorts is if it somehow furthers the examination of the character or characters themselves. The shorts are meant to be little slices only, not a full serving. For actual overall plot in S3 . . . well, that's Gojira's department, not mine.

And regarding characterization, as I said before, one of the great things about SatAM is that they allowed the writers to take Sonic to both highs and lows. He's shown as extremely confident a great deal of the time, yes, but he's also been shown as discouraged, self-doubting, and miserable. For example, one of his most oft-cited moments of emotional range is when he cried when he wasn't able to save Uncle Chuck in Ultra Sonic, and an entire episode - Sonic's Nightmare - was dedicated to showing him obsessing over his weaknesses and doubting his abilities. He's also shown a good deal of remorse over Cat and other Freedom Fighters that he hasn't been able to save. This short is a continuation and distillation of elements that are a part of Sonic's already established characterization as can be seen in the cartoon itself. Further, part of his established characterization is that even when he gets knocked low he picks himself back up again, bouncing back from every defeat with a mental and emotional swiftness that befits his physical speed, a trait that he's shown in this latest page and will naturally continue on into the next, which is also the last. I'm very big on characterization and try to pull as much as I can from the existing work when I'm writing fan material.

Anyway, while I disagree with your criticism, I still appreciate it and welcome both it and any future critique. It's very rare that I get anyone willing to go into depth on what they think of my writing - for good or for ill - and it's refreshing that someone has taken the time to do so. Cheers!

[chalcara]

I know the font's too large, I've seen it when the first page went online - I decided to keep it that big for consistency's sake. It'll be fixed for the print version.

On the rain: Each page tends takes me between 6 and 8 hours as it is, and while I *could* make it look much more realistic that would easily double the time I need per page. And well, would that be worth it? I decided no. You obviously feel differently. A better artist would've managed to do realistic rain without huge timeloss - But I'm not such a good artist and thus you got the quick rain. And while you can rightfully grieve about the lack of realismn, it does what it's supposed to do - you DID recognize it as rain afterall. Comic Panels aren't fine-art; their sole purpose is to communicate the setting/story/mood and emotions.

Thank you for the critique, it's been pretty spot on.



But on your writing one:
Just because it's not your prefered style of writing, it doesn't mean it's "questionable". One of the important skills in giving criticismn is to seperate personal preference from objective problems with a story, and well - you kinda failed at that there. It's fine to not like something and say so, but it's not fine to pass it off as objective judgement of worth. And it's especially NOT fine to go all couch-psychoanalytician on the writer based on that.

Now, to make it clear, this not a comment on your view (and actually, I've been happy to read that) but how you presented it. Opinions are important to hear and they give us something to discuss - but they rarely make useful critiques.

[Glitcher]

Just because it's not your prefered style of writing, it doesn't mean it's "questionable". One of the important skills in giving criticismn is to seperate personal preference from objective problems with a story, and well - you kinda failed at that there.

Opinions are important to hear and they give us something to discuss - but they rarely make useful critiques.

What? Didn't I just say "I have nothing against introspective short stories"? It's not the style that bothers me, but the execution. I find the writing melodramatic and uncharacteristic of Sonic; his bouts of depression in the show not being so heavy. I just think there could have been more variety and plot to balance the internal struggle. Your last sentence doesn't even make sense. My critique is my opinion! The same goes for everyone. My impression of this comic is subjective, not objective, and I'm just voicing my thoughts on the quality. Jim Doe also responded to my criticism on the writing, but at least he didn't get all huffy and defensive about it.

[chalcara]

Just because it's not your prefered style of writing, it doesn't mean it's "questionable". One of the important skills in giving criticismn is to seperate personal preference from objective problems with a story, and well - you kinda failed at that there.

Opinions are important to hear and they give us something to discuss - but they rarely make useful critiques.

What? Didn't I just say "I have nothing against introspective short stories"? It's not the style that bothers me, but the execution. I find the writing melodramatic and uncharacteristic of Sonic; his bouts of depression in the show not being so heavy. I just think there could have been more variety and plot to balance the internal struggle. Your last sentence doesn't even make sense. My critique is my opinion! The same goes for everyone. My impression of this comic is subjective, not objective, and I'm just voicing my thoughts on the quality. Jim Doe also responded to my criticism on the writing, but at least he didn't get all huffy and defensive about it.

Nope, a critique is NOT an opinion. Later is personal feelings, former is an systematic analysis in regards of form, implementation and (depending on the school of criticism) the intent of a given work. I know the internet/common day usage blurrs it a bit, but there's quite a difference between those two things.

[furrykef]

The problem is that objectivity is subjective.

[John Roberts]

Glitcher: No one is getting 'huffy' here mate, least of all Chal. Lay off the needless mud-slinging - it's not needed here.

[Glitcher]

Nope, a critique is NOT an opinion. Later is personal feelings, former is an systematic analysis in regards of form, implementation and (depending on the school of criticism) the intent of a given work. I know the internet/common day usage blurrs it a bit, but there's quite a difference between those two things.

Chalcara, this is not a school essay and I'm not writing an impartial analysis that examines the style and form of a ten-page Sonic fan comic when you say I'm not supposed to express how I feel about it. Others like John, SAA and Gojira have all stated their personal opinion on the comic, yet I'm the only one you reprimanded because I blasted your partner. But seriously now, I don't hold any ill will towards you or Jim Doe. I just think the writing and some of the art could have been improved, and it's unfair to try and undermine my opinion because I'm the only one who expressed negatively on certain aspects of the comic.

[chief]

I think she just means you sounded like a douche when you did it. Example calling Jim a teen going through a emo phase. Personally I'm not fond of the first arc for similar reasons. As much as I can't stand Sonic he did come across a bit too emo. Okay a bit is a understatement but I was expecting the razer to come out any minute.
Thats all fine and dandy, but going and say.. I dunno calling the writer a emo teen.. I'm thinking thats where some of this comes in at. At the end you just sounded like a douche. Which.. cool..Being a douche is fun...Get to see a lot of pussy and all.


But no ones trying to get all huffy and puffy here or start a lynch mob against you for what you said. So lets all calm it down a bit everyone. Smoke a joint, relax..

[Gojira007]

So lets all calm it down a bit everyone. Smoke a joint, relax..

NO! Chal 'n' Glitcher should put up their fucking dukes and slug it out with each other, and the last one standing is the Winner of the Argument. That's how things work around here, dammitall...and if it isn't, it should be.

[chief]

Hmmm...Good idea Gorjira! *tosses knifes into the forum* Go at'er!

[randomizer]

I agree with many of your points Glitcher, as I also find it somewhat out of character, but I'm not an artist and my only stories are cliche so I can't do a very good critique as I don't know what I'm supposed to look for. I can see where both Chal and Jim are coming from as well.

On another note I agree with the others that the ad hominem comment about Jim's age was not needed to make your point.

[spoonfullvon]

i'll say that for all its melodramatics, its still a treat to get into a character's head this much, because of the simple fact that we rarely do in any of the regular sonic media.

[Gojira007]

Excellent hero shot to close out on. Good job, Jim 'n' chal, I think your first go at this Shorts stuff was pretty successful.

[Jim Doe]

I would like to thank everyone for reading and commenting, I would like to thank Lady Chal for bringing her excellent pictures to my ragged words, I would like to thank John and Chief for running this whole thing, and I would like to thank the academy for this loverly award for Best Scriptwriter in the Universe. It's very shiny and will look wonderful in the cabinet under my bathroom sink.

You guys are the awesome ones! You are!

[Glitcher]

Hmmm...Good idea Gorjira! *tosses knifes into the forum* Go at'er!

Fine, if that's the way you want to play it.

*Grabs knife and stabs Chalcara in the heart, then proceeds to run around FUS murdering everyone involved in Sea3on.*

[Gojira007]

Bring it on, Glitcher. I like you, but if you're bringing out Superman, I gotta bring out...

THE GODDAMMED BATMAN!!!