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@  Wulfsbane : (09 September 2019 - 10:12 AM)

We'll probably see Tracer soon

@  Shadow : (06 September 2019 - 10:48 PM)

I'd rather see Mai in Smash

@  Wulfsbane : (06 September 2019 - 09:05 AM)

I'm more surprised about the Fatal Fury character.

@  Wulfsbane : (06 September 2019 - 08:00 AM)

Really wasn't keen on the idea of Sans being playable, but I guess he's in the same vein as Ness/Lucas

@  Wulfsbane : (06 September 2019 - 08:00 AM)

I think it works.

@  GamemasterAn... : (05 September 2019 - 06:53 AM)

So...Sans is a Mii Gunner costume for Smash. Comments?

@  Wulfsbane : (31 August 2019 - 08:00 PM)

Alright, AEW's All Out was pretty freaking good.

@  Wulfsbane : (20 August 2019 - 06:22 AM)

The Knux will Layeth the Smacketh Down all over your Candy Ass!

@  GamemasterAn... : (20 August 2019 - 05:59 AM)

"Finally, the Knux...HAS COME BACK...to Angel Island!"

@  Wulfsbane : (19 August 2019 - 07:26 PM)

Strangely I can see it.

@  Shadow : (18 August 2019 - 10:39 PM)

Imagine Dwayne Johnson voicing Knuckles...

@  Wulfsbane : (17 August 2019 - 02:31 PM)

The Rock has come back? XP

@  chief : (17 August 2019 - 02:26 PM)

http://www.sonicsatam.com/sea3on/ finally...

@  Wulfsbane : (17 August 2019 - 07:40 AM)

Good to hear.

@  chief : (13 August 2019 - 07:27 PM)

We are in talk with background artists actually...

@  Shadow : (13 August 2019 - 12:54 AM)

some traditional cel painted backgrounds would be lovely.

@  Shadow : (13 August 2019 - 12:54 AM)

Is their any plans on what might be added if the budget reaches a certain quota?

@  wildfire : (13 August 2019 - 12:05 AM)

Just saw the preview for Sea3son animated. It looks awesome! Voices are great. I only wish I had money to support.

@  wildfire : (12 August 2019 - 11:30 PM)

Glad to see this place is still bustling. I went through my old comics last night, made me think of you all. I miss this place sometimes.

@  Ishapar : (12 August 2019 - 10:39 AM)

Keep screaming, Redauthar.


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Satam In 2019


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#1 wildfire

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Posted 15 March 2019 - 11:32 PM

So I was at work earlier today and a thought entered into me noggin.  It's been about 20 years since SatAM first entered into our collective lives, and in spite of being apparently set in the future on a distant world, the technology on display is decidedly 90's.  Computers use dated CRT monitors with massive keyboards and CPUs.  I couldn't help but wonder how the technological landscape of Mobius would have been altered if the show had been made now as opposed to 94.  Tech's come a long way in the past quarter century, and we have a lot of things now that writers probably would never have even thought of back in the day.  So in essence, I was wondering...

 

How do you think the world of Sonic SatAM would be different in terms of story, visuals, etc, had it been created in 2019?

 

Tell me your thoughts, show me some art, some quick fanfiction, whatever you like.  I'd honestly love to hear what you all have to say about this one.  Here's a quick example...

 

Though Sonic would never admit it out loud, Rotor's AR display made navigating the streets or Robotropolis a snap.  GPS cut pathways through the city that he would never have thought of on his own.  In spite of this however, he was still not at ease.

"I don't like it Sal.  Why do you have to be here in Buttnik central?  Couldn't you just do it from Knothole?"

"I've already told you Sonic." Princess Sally's portrait popped up in the corner of Sonic's vision as he tore across the city.  "It'd be much too risky to perform this hack remotely.  Robotnik could trace it back to Knothole.  Then we'd all be out of a home."

"But he could trace our comms.  How is this any safer?"

"C.mon Sonic." Rotor jumped in, his portrait joining the princess's as he interjected.  "We've bounced these signals off so many relays it'd take ole bolt breath a year to untie this knot.  Besides, that's why you're running decoy remember?"

"Could ya'll dearly shut yer ever lovin' pie holes?" Bunnie whispered, another portrait popping up on Sonic's HUD.  "Yer makin' me nervous.  But the charges are set, timer's primed, and that dirty ole' SWATbot factory'll be good as gone in five minutes."

Sonic's display highlighted a SWATbot patrol in his path, with a hoot and holler, he tore through the group, ripping several of them off their feet.  "C'mon chrome domes" he shouted as he blew past.  "I ain't got all day."

 

This is just something I was thinking about at work.  There's loads of other things I'm sure.  For instance, you can get a computer these days that projects it's keyboard onto the desk in front of you.  I should also point out, the computer itself is three pen sized cylinders that serve as the entire display.  Tell me things wouldn't look way different if they did things now as opposed to 94.


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#2 chief

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Posted 16 March 2019 - 06:10 AM

Well I can guarantee you a lot of the computer rooms would look plenty different.   Possibly more use of holograms.   I know Nicole did project which was cool but really was the only "advanced" thing.

Probably more use of drones for Robotnic.   Yes, he used bots and some flying ones.  But I can see more of a potential use for those that fly.  Sonic just knocks over any swatbots...But load the skies with flying drones and...Well you can find those pesky freedom fighters quite fast.



#3 ShenFNWoo

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Posted 16 March 2019 - 12:06 PM

To be fair, I think it would look the same. I think it was made that way on purpose. As far back as the 70's, Japanese anime were aware that computers would look like holographic displays and buttons, thought they went with clunky machine designs anyway in some aspects. So it wasn't that they didn't have the imagination to make things look a lot more sleek and polished, i think they simply wanted it to look like 80's future distopias similar to Blade Runner. Upping the design would mean upping the efficiency of the product, and we certainly couldn't have Sonic and a rag tag of freedom fighters going up against idealized cybertronians - they'd get nuked on the spot. At least, they wouldn't be able to compete with them or get away with ...... anything they did in the show. Mistakes would be fatal 100% of the time. There'd be no missed lazer blasts. Security would be impenetrable. Strategies would've found Knothole day 1. Nothing short of having superpowers similar to chaos control would suffice for combatting them. Even the machines themselves would see the impact on the environment, and would possibly come to the conclusion that abuse of such is actually detrimental to their well being, and would've ousted robotnik, seeing him as a hindrance.

No matter how you slice it, being upgraded at all would actually hurt the story. You kind of need this place to be in it's artificial intelligence infancy, because anything better would see that the programs and ais would update themselves and become nigh unbeatable, and all encompassing.

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#4 Shadow

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Posted 17 March 2019 - 02:38 AM

I really think with the era american animation is right now it would not be a good time for this sort of show to be dusted off. With the cal arts bean faces, wave of agenda pushing animators over talented experts, and overall themes of cartoons being slice of life comedies that have very little to no overarching plots would just make a more meme friendly version of AoStH at best.



#5 ShenFNWoo

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Posted 17 March 2019 - 07:28 AM

For some reason I read that as his focus being more on how technology in the show would work with modern vision in mind. Guess I skimmed to fast.

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#6 wildfire

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Posted 17 March 2019 - 03:50 PM

Valid points, but I was more thinking about some of the overall improvements we've had in the past 25 years or so. Sure, thermal imaging could possibly spot Knothole from orbit, but that can be explained away by the sheer volume of life in the Great Forest. AI may be able to quantify Robotnik's impact on the environment, but this is only possible if the humans programming the AI are capable of working within those parameters. In other words, if Snivley and Robotnik are too stupid to put it together, then it's safe to assume AI would fare no better. I truthfully think a lot of the problems of modern tech could be explained away with some creative writing.
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#7 Wulfsbane

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Posted 17 March 2019 - 03:51 PM

The way SatAM seems to be set up is that technology went backwards for a time and just started going forward again within the past several hundred years. So not updating to be technologically advanced would be alright. We did see Robotnik use drone-like machines and other contraptions that still are technically Science Fiction to us today, yet also had stuff that would be considered dated to us today. There's a mix of redunant and future tech in this show, used by both sides.

 

Honestly, I bet you could show SatAM to this generation and while they may say "if this was made today, then they could have x" but I think the more they watch it, the more they see it's actually fine as is. Could they add some things? Sure, but the better question is "Do they need to add things?"

 

 

I really think with the era american animation is right now it would not be a good time for this sort of show to be dusted off. With the cal arts bean faces, wave of agenda pushing animators over talented experts, and overall themes of cartoons being slice of life comedies that have very little to no overarching plots would just make a more meme friendly version of AoStH at best.

 

I gotta agree with this. While I see Sega keeping a close eye on things so it wouldn't be seen as "agenda pushing" (though to be fair, SatAM kinda had an environmental message that wasn't in your face or as cheezy as, say, Captain Planet) or overly meme-y. Of course there would be a few memes here and there but I bet someone who has the time and energy to could dig through SatAM and make a few. On the agenda side of things, I almost guarentee some animator would take , or at least try to, the "implied but open ended" aspect of SallyxNICOLE and make it an actual thing in a newer SatAM... despite the fact it was rather unpopular when Ian mentioned it the first go around (And Aaleah mentioning they wouldn't do it again given the chance.)

 

The lack of long story arcs and making everything 13 minute shorts for the most part is what sucks about today's cartoons. I mean they took beloved shows like Pokemon, Teen Titans, & Powerpuff Girls and turned it into Pokemon Sun & Moon, Teen Titans GO, and "New" Powderpuff Girls. Would SatAM befall the same fate or would it be spared? I hate to say it but it would be the former.

 

 

No matter how you slice it, being upgraded at all would actually hurt the story. You kind of need this place to be in it's artificial intelligence infancy, because anything better would see that the programs and ais would update themselves and become nigh unbeatable, and all encompassing.

 

Kinda got to agree with this too, NICOLE had limits and so did Robotnik in terms of AI. Remove the limits then it just becomes a matter of "who makes the first mistake" or "who adapts faster"


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#8 ShenFNWoo

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Posted 17 March 2019 - 05:33 PM

Valid points, but I was more thinking about some of the overall improvements we've had in the past 25 years or so. Sure, thermal imaging could possibly spot Knothole from orbit, but that can be explained away by the sheer volume of life in the Great Forest.

Hell, let's expand on that idea. Let's say that the trees all emit a sort of energy that makes seeing anything on the forest bed impossible. Or that all frequencies are scattered, making deep scans worthless. Every single aspect you could add to make the great forest untraceable..... A more advanced AI would still find it. Extremely fast. It would run thousands of simulations within minutes, triangulating every single point of exit the freedom fighters ever took and find them that way. Or it would send thousands of probes that would map out the place visually and return. And if they get attacked, they'd simply find out where they were attacked, how frequently in that area they were attacked, and send weaponized drones to accompany them, if the map or data they acquired wasn't good enough already. Saying all that was taken out, they could simply chip animals and have them run from one side of the forest to the other, making some sort of dragnet. And finally, any and all freedom fighters they've captured would also be chipped and released, or they would use chips as weapons and shoot them like BBs into their bodies rather than try to fry them with lasers. There's so many ways in which any competent AI coul'dve found them without the use of satellite imagery it's insane. And they'd employ ALL of these tactics at once.
 

AI may be able to quantify Robotnik's impact on the environment, but this is only possible if the humans programming the AI are capable of working within those parameters. In other words, if Snivley and Robotnik are too stupid to put it together, then it's safe to assume AI would fare no better. I truthfully think a lot of the problems of modern tech could be explained away with some creative writing.


That's not necessarily true. There's only so smart or should I rather say, so many facets the human mind can handle. That's why they rely on AI, since you know, YOU can't add 1+1 a million times in a second. I forget what it's called, but once you get AI to a certain point (and this can be done accidentally, you don't need to intentionally try to implement it), it will update and upgrade making itself smarter and more capable. It won't just limit itself to what the humans who made it thought, or what their morals and values would entail, it would think "beyond", and probably develop a parental complex. The environment being wasted might not seem like a concern to you regarding them, but you forget, environment has an effect on machinery too, and can get in the way of progress, so the AI MUST consider that. It's even especially something worth considering if the AI has a complex like I mentioned before, as it would (could) see lifeforms as an asset to be used in helping it expand itself. So yeah, long story short once more, AI that advances itself would definitely see Snively and Robotnik as nuisances and would remove them, however it sees fit.

AI is a lot more capable and highly dangerous, that's why we, in real life, are actually very afraid of what they might do if we ever let them go off the leash.

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#9 Shadow

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Posted 18 March 2019 - 12:07 PM

When it comes down to it, we really need to stop waiting for Sega to throw us a bone and show pity on us. If we want a new SatAM show, it will be up to us to make it ourselves from the ground up. Everything will have to be fan funded and fan produced, just like how many indy cartoons and movies are becoming more and more these days.



#10 wildfire

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Posted 18 March 2019 - 11:02 PM

Hard pressed to argue with any of those points, but somehow I don't think the average person puts that much thought into these types of things. After all, we're not Elon Musk are we? Besides, at the end of the day it's a story meant to entertain, and as long as it accomplishes that goal, then I'm satisfied. And yeah, the time for SEGA to throw SatAM fans a bone is LONG past. That's why Sea3son is so great. I can't think of a better love letter to the series. Hell, it's kept me coming back here at age 32 after all. 😉
Hard pressed to argue with any of those points, but somehow I don't think the average person puts that much thought into these types of things. After all, we're not Elon Musk are we? Besides, at the end of the day it's a story meant to entertain, and as long as it accomplishes that goal, then I'm satisfied. And yeah, the time for SEGA to throw SatAM fans a bone is LONG past. That's why Sea3son is so great. I can't think of a better love letter to the series. Hell, it's kept me coming back here at age 32 after all. 😉
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#11 Shadow

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 08:10 AM

The comic is nice and all, but its apparent we want a lot more than that. Which begs the question if anyone knows any animators or competent flash animators in the community that would be willing to commit to such a project if it ever got rolling.



#12 LogiTeeka

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 02:35 PM

To be honest, current shows like “Teen Titans Go” and the PPG reboot feel like your average 90s cartoon than those of the actual decade. The cartoons of the early 90s, while much more ambitious and daring compared to their predecessors in the proceeding decades, were less action/drama oriented and generally more surrealist/slice-of-life.

In today’s cartoon environment of more self-contained episodes and “agenda pushing”, I think something like the 1st season of SatAM would fare much better than the more ongoing/serious storyline of the 2nd season.

#13 wildfire

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Posted 20 March 2019 - 07:44 PM

Well, my initial thoughts were more about the look of things now as opposed to then. There are obviously some interesting plot points as well, see the AI bit above. But I was more wondering if people thought the show would look significantly different in terms of overall design. Like for instance, I wonder if Robotropolis might resemble modern day Tokyo a bit more (I watch lots of anime these days) maybe with the crumbling remains of old Mobotropolis being shown more. I always thought it was a bit strange that Robotropolis looked completely different from its predecessor. I also figure on Nicole having a sleeker design, more closely resembling a modern day smart phone. Maybe they could even holo project the cyber lynx version we know from Archie. Just a few thoughts, do with them what you will.
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#14 Ishapar

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Posted 21 March 2019 - 05:51 PM

Naw, I'd say the city design would stay the same.  Mobotropolis is it's own city, and I think it does a good job without having to be influenced by modern city designs.  Mobius isn't earth, after all, so the city designs wouldn't be the same as earth cities.  I would agree that Robotnik would have better security scattered throughout the city, but I believe it can still be logical for Robotnik to not be able to find Knothole even with current technology.  Just because we have satellite images doesn't mean we can see and find everything on the planet.  Believe it or not, there are still places on earth that still remain mostly uncharted and hidden from even our tech (the deep interiors of the Congo and Amazon comes to mind).  With Knothole being hidden in the forest and mostly underground, it wouldn't be easy to locate.  I would propose that in Mobius there can be natural occurances that could obscure technology (example:  maybe a type of Mobian mineral/crystal that obscures cameras or radio waves might be abundant in the Great Forest near Knothole's location).


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#15 wildfire

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Posted 22 March 2019 - 09:59 PM

The argument that Mobius isn't Earth, while an understandable one, is flimsy. Try as you might, one cannot deny that the design of many elements of SatAN was based on contemporary design elements of the time. That's the whole basis for this post after all. If you were to look into it, I'm certain the exact inspirations could be located. But that's neither here nor there. As for certain elements interfering with technology, it's possible, but not terribly likely. Any technology developed on Mobius would likely take these types of factors into account. For instance, the large crystal in Ultra Sonic was likely meant to be used as a power source for some massive machine. Or maybe even spread out to power SWATbots. I do find it strange you don't see any kind of charging stations around for a city run entirely by automation. There's an interesting thought in and of itself.

Sorry if it seems like I'm shitting on your post. I promise that's not my intent. Just regurgitating the first things that came to mind.
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#16 Ishapar

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Posted 25 March 2019 - 09:22 AM

Yep, I'm offended matey....

 

Joking.

 

I still side more with Mobius being its own world instead of Earth, and I believe this was the intention of Satam and the early Archie comics before SOJ influence with the Dreamcast era.


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#17 LogiTeeka

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Posted 25 March 2019 - 10:03 AM

I still side more with Mobius being its own world instead of Earth, and I believe this was the intention of Satam and the early Archie comics before SOJ influence with the Dreamcast era.

 

Actually, the head writer for SatAM, Ben Hurst, was intending to have Mobius take place on a post-apocalyptic Earth way back during the show's airing. Had the 3rd season been greenlit, it would've revealed that Robotnik and Snively were the time-warped survivors of a nuclear war that wiped out all of humanity (possibly) and gave rise to the Mobians.

 

It just happened to be a big coincidence that SoJ had the series take place on Earth the entire time, though I can't help but wonder if Karl Bollers was familiar with Hurst's unused plans and reutilized it for the Archie comics as a compromise between the two canons. I mean, he was the same guy who resurrected Nate Morgan, who was originally a scrapped character for SatAM.



#18 Wulfsbane

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Posted 25 March 2019 - 07:23 PM

 

I still side more with Mobius being its own world instead of Earth, and I believe this was the intention of Satam and the early Archie comics before SOJ influence with the Dreamcast era.

 

Actually, the head writer for SatAM, Ben Hurst, was intending to have Mobius take place on a post-apocalyptic Earth way back during the show's airing. Had the 3rd season been greenlit, it would've revealed that Robotnik and Snively were the time-warped survivors of a nuclear war that wiped out all of humanity (possibly) and gave rise to the Mobians.

 

It just happened to be a big coincidence that SoJ had the series take place on Earth the entire time, though I can't help but wonder if Karl Bollers was familiar with Hurst's unused plans and reutilized it for the Archie comics as a compromise between the two canons. I mean, he was the same guy who resurrected Nate Morgan, who was originally a scrapped character for SatAM.

 

 

And Penders took that post apocolyptic Earth bit and turned it into a crappy, B-Movie, Star Trek offshoot version.

 

I think Bollers did some research into SatAM and I would assume around the time Hurst was trying to do the Season 3 movie he had contact with some of Archie's crew, which is kinda how Penders got involved. I wouldn't be surprised if Karl was cordial with Hurst during that time and was supportive. I know Bollers wanted Sonic & Amy to be a thing but I remember his ideas for Sally being a lot better than what we got for that timeframe so he did have respect for the partial source material


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#19 Shadow

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Posted 26 March 2019 - 06:04 PM

A post apocalypse setting does sound good, especially with environmentalism being more and more prevalent in sci fi now. The Sonic OVA did something like that showing the ruins of a flooded New York with Robotropolis built over top of it. To keep Robotnik as a threat and not a constantly humiliated buffoon I would anchor him down as being far too busy to deal with Sonic as he would be strapped into the network itself through many plugs and cables assembling something large that would be unveiled in a late season event. In his place would be Snively, with maybe two comical robots akin to Scratch and Grounder to be his muscle. Robotnik would be merely a face on the screen a lot of the time like Doctor Claw from Inspector Gadget.



#20 wildfire

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Posted 27 March 2019 - 10:43 PM

I always loved the image of Dr. Robotnik in his command chair. Something about it seemed very sinister. I mean, I liked that he wasn't afraid to get his hands dirty, but I always felt he would've been more menacing just as a presence that Snivley was persistently afraid of. Like, they never really show how violent he is, but it's always there ya know?
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